Ctrl-Alt-Del, Restart

[kihaku]

Please select an option, first of all.

Second, I, personally, would like to move the site to Invisionfree, as I know it to allow much more freedom in terms of customization, as well as being much more stream-lined than Proboards. I know a lot of you were raised on Proboards, so that's why I'd like to put it to a vote.

The question of keeping/changing our energy/class system has also come up. What does everyone think? This is the definitive thread, so PLEASE, everyone post their opinions.

[Gareeku]

Like I said before, I like these current boards, but that's just me. And maybe the class system does need looking at, but I do not think it should be abolished. It is there for a reason, and that reason is to keep people from having loads of instant kill attacks etc.

[Jimmy Claymore]

I posted my ideas for a back-story and explanation and also vote in favour of new energy rules. Dunno 'bout new abilities but the MR system might work if you modified it. Its pretty similar in essence.

[Shei'ki\Agatha]

MR System? No, thank you. No offense, but its too darn simple for something like this. Lets keep it in its original spirit, like forcedheroes, if you dont mind. I don't knw why we should even change the host, either; really now, what's the point?

[Archer]

OK, I posted up my suggestion in the admin area, but I feel it also needs to be seen by everyone, so here are my thoughts.

The problem, as I see it, is that in past revivals of LoD, there's been a bit too much caught in just picking it up and carrying on.With me, it always seemed like effort within about 2 weeks to continue posting, as it felt we were dragging something from a grave.

However, that's not the feeling we should have; Dragonia is a fun place to vent our creativity. So, I propose this solution, which should be able to allow everyone to start afresh in whatever way they see fit:

Firstly, we need to cut down on staff. It's gotten to the point where the non-admins are a minority. I propose one Admin and two Moderators; the Admin is effectively 'in charge', and runs the site along the right path, and the Mods help him in any way they can. However, all major site issues are discussed between the three, keepin the democratic system the old admins used to have. Both Mike (Kihaku) and myself have said we'd be happy to step down if the need for it came.

Secondly, the main problem lies in keeping all that we love about LoD, but reviving it in a fresh enough way so that it doesn't get stale too quickly. So, I propose a rennovated way of catogorising events;
We have Ancient History, such as Dragonian folklore, how the planet came to be, stuff that happened centuries ago.
Then we have Recent History, such as the Mirror of Pockus Saga, the Saiyan Invasion Saga, and such. Things that have happened during our time here, and are integral to some returning characters. We can tweak the odd detail to make it fit coherantly with everything else, but otherwise these remain the same.
Finally, we have Current Events; what happens after the restart. These start roughly one year after the end of the Recent History section, and we start in a peaceful time. We then have an integration period, where everyone brings their characters into the Current Events, we form a few intercharacter relationships, and once everythings started (say, 2 weeks?), we start with a saga, ensuring it's lead by a competant writer who has the time and motivation to see it through to the finish.

As for characters, you are welcome to bring back an existing character-- maybe tweaking the history to include the time between Recent History and Current Events. You'd be allowed to keep your moveset, and all character history would still be relevant, just with a few phrases tweaked to indicate how they arrived on the planet, when, and what they did.

If you want to bring a new character in, as I believe myself and Mike both intend to, then you can either simply start afresh completely with a new 60 Credit Character (as I will), or trade in your old character for one of equal point value.

While we are collecting the Recent History events together, you are also welcome to either remove your character from the proceedings (we will most likely be able to fill the gap through the use of NPCs if you do not wish to be assosciated with the events), or you can write a brief summary of what happened to your character; or, you can of course leave it open and conclude it at a later date.

I hope that the above system will manage to restart the site in a way which is both the same and new, meaning everyone can get the most from the site.


Opinions?

[Shei'ki\Agatha]

Razion, you are a genius. Still though... You!? Step down? It'd be a crime! With an insightful and well thought out answer like that... shit, you should be an admin

(wowzers I sound like a bitch...)

[Ryan - Loki]

Well obviously I have a few suggestions I’d like to put forward, and a few opinions on some of the suggestions that others have given; I’m glad to see how much passion is going into this and how much process has been made already, I hope I can add to some of that.

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As far as the forum is concerned I’ve always liked proboards. I’ve always found it appealing to look at and relatively easy to use, despite not being able to recreate this exact same forum design on another proboards forum – and trust me, I tried EVERYTHING I could think of. So yes, sometimes proboards can be difficult to use, unless you’ve got both the time to figure everything out about it or you’re some kind of proboards master like Robbie seemed to be.
I’ve also had some experience with invisionfree too, though not even nearly as much as I have with proboards, though despite this I’ve found invisionfree, despite not knowing everything about it yet, relatively easy to use. My only problem with invisionfree is that I’ve never seen one of their forums that looks as good as a proboards forum can be – taking our one here at LoD for example (no offence intended at all to MR Mike/Jimmy) – but that’s my ONLY issue regarding the forum.

I like the history ideas, though I was thinking perhaps moving things only a year later isn’t enough; perhaps longer? I was thinking 5-7 years down the line maybe. It would leave for slightly more detailed history section, a longer calm of peace upon Dragonia, and for great character development for us who will be re-using old characters – such as me, of course.

Like Richard said I also think cutting down on Staff is a good idea, though whoever steps down/is dropped is quite obviously going to be missed. Each and everyone one of us has given a lot to LoD, whether in terms of posting, ideas, bringing in new members, the list is endless. I think that we should decide on who’s going to lead/remain in the staff, probably best in a vote? Though even after deciding I do not think it should take effect until after the site is properly back up and running, as I think we can all help and move things along quicker as a larger unit, rather than simply three people at the moment.

Personally I think the problem with things going stale after a few weeks/months after previous re-vamps has been because we’ve not changed enough, that we’ve just tweaked a few SLIGHT things and tried to force the same old site to breath again. I think that we need to move further away from Forced Heroes and add more realism to LoD. Great battles with unnatural, mind-boggling abilities is all well and good and should stay to a moderated extent, but with realism we also gain the fact that people may be able to relate with the events of our characters and Dragonia, which I think could only help the writing process.

I think concerning the re-vamp items (keeping/changing our energy/class system) that it could do with a bit a tweaking. I think when devising it we were moving on the right track, but we’ve still got a bit of moving to do. I think it should be kept, but only as a base form so we can move on from it, change and improve it. I believe we should even go as far as re-looking at our profile template, and possibly changing it – drastically if needed.
A major problem in the past is that in time our characters become too powerful, even with the old rules, restrictions and credit costs, so when new characters arrive they may feel that they’re overshadowed by the current members and their arsenal of ultimate abilities – I know I’ve felt like that a tad in similar situations on other sites.

I’ve written quite a lot already, so I wont go into anything else just yet as I’d like to hear some of your opinions on all of this first, so we can cover and finalise some current issues rather than bring forward a load of new ones at the same time.

[shizuka]

Even though i said lets just get to it. I have one suggestion and i could care less if you all dont agree with me. if you remember in the past everyone kept saying "oh i got caught up with this and that" (and im even speaking for myself cuz i just did it), Im getting tired at looking at all these board (wait, just LoD) where i see Ryan/loki. "Im sorry that i got caught up in this and that"

So my opinion is. No Razion shouldnt back down. But Ryan/Loki should. All he does is give excuses as to why everything happens and i liked this rpg board alot. I just can not stay quiet to much longer about who should be admin and who shouldnt. ^^

GO KIHAKU!!!!!!!!

[Garoten Reklor]

Lots of good thoughts here so far - not sure how much I can add, but here's my two cents anyway:

I think if we're going to re-vamp, lets re-vamp in a big way. The half attempts just haven't worked. Let's take a look at everything - character system, combat, everything - keep what we can't live without and overhaul the rest.

As far as staff goes, there are two ways we can do that, I think. One is to cut to a minimal staff, and that's wise, but that minimal staff would have to be on the ball all the time. On the other hand, we might do just as well to keep a large staff and divide the responsibilities better. That way if one guy goes AWOL for a bit, everything doesn't come screeching to a halt. I guess I'm thinking mostly of sagas. When/If we do start sagas again, I think we need at least two people 'in charge' of them at all times. That's no criticism of the guys who have run sagas so far - we've had great ones - but it's just a safegaurd.

Im indifferent about a site move. We'll do fine either way. The more pertinent issue is keeping our writers engaged and involved where we'll make time - even once a week - to post. In light of that, I'll probably be creating a new character and letting Falkan take his place in the history section. If it's not too bold, I'd like to suggest we all do the same. Maybe even push the gap to ten or more years to aid in that process. I think we're just so used to the same characters and abilities that even a great saga becomes familiar too quickly, because we all know what the characters will do even before they do it.

I think that's enough rambling for now...but I'll recap to make it simple:

1. Re-vamp in a BIG way
2. Keep most of our staff and distribute responsibilities as evenly as possible
3. Move - or don't move - whatever
4. All-new cast of characters

[Ryan - Loki]

That's your opinion and you're entitled to it Liz.

I make no excuses for being away from the site. Yes there were reasons, but they are not excuses for not being around/posting. What you must also remember is that for a long while I remained, when most had gone - and in fact besides Gareeku's new post from a few days back, I was the last one to post IC, along with Dimitri – yes me being somewhat unorganised with my saga was a contributing factor in the decline of activity on the site, but it’s also impossible to run a saga without members who are willing to post in it; it’s a terrible cycle, and I dragged myself into it.

Sometimes the factors that real life gives us just get in the way/overwhelm us all, even you Liz, and just because I’m an admin makes me no different – yes it means I have much more responsibility than you do for the site, but that’s why I made sure there was a large admin staff, to deal with stuff if one, or a few of us, became unable to be around.

As I said in my earlier post within this thread, LoD has always been like a second home to me and I hold this site above all overs, always have done – sorry Mike and Jimmy, once again no offence towards MR intended - and if everyone else shares your opinion Liz, or a remotely similar opinion, then I'd happily bow down from being Admin, if that's what people think is in the best interest of the site.

[kihaku]

-_-; Thanks liz.

Okay, let's put the brakes on and take a quick break. I've been reading, and it seems that most of the old crew has taken a liking to the idea of coming back, but how we do it is becoming an issue. From my count, a majority of the members want to change things, a couple in a big way. A minority want things to remain the same as it always has been, one even wants to move the clock backwards to a system more like FH.

Allow me, if you will, the opportunity to share with you all a phase I learned when in training to be an Archery instructor:

"Everything about where the arrow flies has to do with your body. As soon as you let go, physics takes care of the rest, but aiming, putting tension on the bow, all if it is the body. Therefore, if you pull and release the exact same way one hundred times, the arrow will hit the exact same place one hundred times, and you will split 99 arrows. However, if you miss that one hundred times, then you're obviously doing something wrong. The smallest changes can make the biggest impact."

At that point, he took his stance and hit a bull's-eye. -_-;

LoD is a FANTASTIC site. I love it here, when it comes to the best kind of writing community, we were almost dead-on. However, if we can die and revive so often, then we must be doing something wrong. When do the lulls come? After the Sagas, every time, like clock-work.

Now, I am simply the Archivist, I don't have much say in how the site is to be run or anything, but these are my suggestions that I hope will satisfy everyone to a certain degree, but let me remind everyone:

IN A COMPROMISE, NO ONE GETS EVERYTHING THEY WANT.

First off, I just want to say, that as the main proponent of the "Site-shift" to invisionfree, I'm dropping the issue. There are too many people who don't care for any decision to be reached, so let's not discuss that anymore.

We cut back on Administration to three: a head-admin that can settle major disputes and problems as well as board maintennance, and two moderators that peruse the board to make sure things are running smoothly, I'll leave that open to interpretation. The reason for three is in case things need to be put to a vote, there won't be a tie. I know for a fact that all the administration staff as it is would be willing to step down if it would make LoD a better place, so we shall decide amongst ourselves in the Adminstration Area who stays and who becomes another member.

However, when it comes to a saga, we can use the "Saga Leader, Saga Staff" idea from FH and our glory days, where whomever came up with the Saga concept and story picks two volunteer temporary moderators to help run it, whether they're staff already or not. This will allow everyone a chance to help out, as well as keep a constant set of staff members.

Next: Board history. I love the history, I think it's rich, thick, and buttery too. Therefore I suggest we keep the history as suggested by Razion and Gareeku with an "Ancient" (Dragonia's history as laid down by Robbie in the Beginning), "Recent" (Sagas and "legends" of past characters), and "Current" (the action as it begins once we start back up). The space between "Recent" and "Current" should be set at five years of undisturbed peace. This, I think, is the optimum amount of time for anyone's previous characters to have taken their leave of Dragonia, or if they prefer to remain, little enough time for nothing of any significance to have changed (if they so wished).

That itself is another issue. It wouldn't be in LoD's best interest to force everyone to simply set their beloved characters to rest and start for scratch. Me, personally, I love making new characters, but not everyone is me. Therefore we should give everyone the option to either give up their character for a new one of equal value, or keep their character with the condition that they keep the afore-mentioned time gap in mind.

The profile template is fine as is, nothing needs to be changed, in my opinion. However, character creation does need to have a definite stance. The point has been brought up that characters can gain a lot of power too quickly, which can overwhelm new players. To balance this, we can either increase the costs for new moves and alterations, or increase the number of credits offered for a new charcter to start with. FH's solution to this (which we used for a long time) was everyone was allowed a SET NUMBER OF POWERS, five Class I's, seven Class II's, and I've forgotten how many Class III's X3. From that set number, further powers then used the credit system. We can either change the credit system as we're using it, or revert to the previous system of a set number of powers (which I have never had issues with). If we implement either of those, that should solve the over-power issue.

Another definite issue is the "energy system." When I suggested we lose the "Character Class," I wasn't refering to powers, but that acolyte, mage, spiritual warrior, elementalist malarky that only complicated things that should be fairly straight forward. Granted, it seemed like a good idea at the time, so I believe that there is a grain of truth to it all. Rather than making it a required section on the profile template, I suggest we use them as "examples of different spiritual disciplines through which a character may attain their powers." I think to make things clearly defined and simple is the best course of action if we ever hope to recruit new members. The Energy itself is just that: clear and simple. It's easy like Yu Yu Hakusho, but still has that DBZ feel that LoD was based on, but is also different enough to still be anything else.

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Did I miss anything?

[Archer]

I agree whole-heartedly; there's nothing I can think of to add or change above.

[Garoten Reklor]

Excellent.

Not as elaborate as I've argued for, but as he said, nobody gets everything in a compromise. Lets do this, and soon!

[Jimmy Claymore]

... why is my site getting a pummeling?
M.Rs perfectly fine we just don't nuke countries on a regular basis...

Actually, thats one of my suggestions, a rule stating that heavy damage to the planet or powers that could cause extensive damage will be pursued by whatever celestial forces are watching. I mean, we've destroyed the planet at LEAST three times in my recent memory, we might need to cut down...

And I still think we need some kinda plot, apart from that I'll agree totally with Mike (which is, coincidentally, also our admin strategy on Midnight Reaping... sadly)

[kihaku]

I know jimmy, don't worry, I have just as much invested in MR as you do, but that doesn't mean that we should try to make them more similar. LoD was built off of that whole DBZ Saga-esque stuff, and it has become as much a part of the site as the L.

A few changes were all that's needed, nothing major.